If you’re trying to understand how 8A in the Fontainebleau grading system compares to the V Scale or Yosemite Decimal System (YDS), here’s your quick answer:
- 8A on the Fontainebleau scale equals V11 on the V Scale
- 8A also translates to about 5.14a in sport climbing grades
In this article, you’ll see how these systems compare, why the conversions aren’t always perfect, and how to use each scale depending on where you’re climbing.
Key Takeaways
- The Font scale and the V scale are two of the most prominent bouldering difficulty grading systems. Each system brings its own creative approach and deep cultural history.
- We’re often asked how to convert between 8a and V grades. This complexity is due to differences in aesthetic, route type, and local grading philosophy.
- If climbers are well informed of both systems, they can establish reasonable goals. This is most important when they are traveling or climbing in other states outside of their home state.
- Of course, experience, technique and mental preparation factor heavily into how climbers approach and experience grade progression.
- Prioritizing the individual’s growth leads to better long-term performance. It increases the overall enjoyment of your climbing experience by leaps and bounds.
- Consider grades as useful milestones along a learning path rather than definite indicators of ability. It’s important for climbers to change their mindset as they develop.
The 8a to V Scale Conversion Explained
Converting grades from one scale to the other takes an expert knowledge of all climbing systems, multiple climbing disciplines, and grade conversion methods. Understanding this is key to properly rating difficulty. The 8a grade is a derivative of the French system that is commonly used in Europe for sport climbing.
The V scale, or “Vermin scale,” is more widely used for bouldering in the United States. Both scales are used to quantify the difficulty of a climb. They use different scales with different numbers and letters, so converting from one to the other is not straightforward.
The best way to understand the conversion is with a table. Below is a quick look at how 8a grades line up with V grades:
| French (8a scale) | V Scale (Bouldering) |
|---|---|
| 7a | V6 |
| 7b | V8 |
| 7c | V9 |
| 8a | V11 |
| 8b | V13 |
| 8c | V15 |
One big misconception is assuming that a grade in one grading system directly translates to the equivalent grade in another grading system. In truth, things like the type of rock, style of climbing, and location can change how hard a climb feels.
The UIAA scale, adopted internationally in 1967, employs Roman numerals to represent the challenge of the climb. It provides greater flexibility in modeling minor changes in difficulty, while not always matching up perfectly with the 8a/V scales.
Knowing both the 8a and V systems helps climbers talk clearly with others across the world. It also aids in picking routes that fit their skill set and setting better training goals.
Factors Messing with Direct Conversion
Copying grades directly over from the 8a to V scale is not straightforward. Climbing grading systems climbed out of multiple rabbit holes at multiple times and from multiple places. Consequently, each system grew in a distinctly different way.
Though Fritz Benesch’s 1894 scale was simple, it was only 1 to 7. In 1923, Willo Welzebach turned everything upside down. This shift made the work of trying to make grade equivalents between the two systems much more difficult for anybody. While the UIAA system is still able to cover more variations of climbs, its implementation can look very different from place to place.
Climbing style comes into play a lot as well. Take your friend who excels on overhangs, for instance—they may crush a V11 boulder problem. By comparison, they might fare worse on an 8a path needing more specialized technical skills.
For a given grade, one climber might find the climb far easier or more difficult based on their strengths and climbing background. Their experience and background shape how they approach each problem. Experience has a huge impact on what a climber considers to be an easy or hard route.
In practice, then, two climbers can have different experiences of the difficulty of a route, even if it is graded the same. Each climbing area has its own method of assigning grades. One climbing gym may label a challenge a V6, and another may label something like it a V8.
The available outdoor spaces can be wildly different. A Font 8a boulder problem in France, for example, will not provide the same experience as a V11 crux in California. Weather and rock conditions are equally important. Humid or wet holds change the friction on the wall, and that can instantly make a climb seem way easier or harder.
How Climbers Experience the Jump
Climbers are very likely to experience a noticeable jump in difficulty when they go up a grade. In fact, going from an 8a to a V7 often feels like an insurmountable leap. The jump is more than just a series of harder moves. It has a huge mental cost associated with it. Most climbers run into a significant barrier around 5.12d/5.13a.
Though the physical distance may be small, they feel trapped. This sensation is heightened if the route involves overhanging terrain, or if the rock is undercut or polished. On other days, severe heat or cold increases the challenge of a climb to an even more dangerous level. This sudden switch affects the experience of the grade in real time.
All climbers do not experience the jump on equal footing. Many climbers experience specific climbs as significantly more difficult or easier than other climbs of the same grade. For others, the rock quality or the steepness of a route are what matters most. A climber could easily flash one 8a but then fail on the next.
It all goes to demonstrate how personal these jumps are. Elite climbers don’t always fit the stereotype. Few of them even look that impressive, but they fight through difficult moves with impressive abilities and exceptional mechanism. Sure, physical strength is important, but technique usually comes out on top.
Climbers who have quick feet, work fluid, and don’t panic jump the best. For the rest of us, it’s always advantageous to think big, but start small and go global by making goals tangible. Climbers aren’t only concerned with ticking the next grade. Instead, they create a series of mini-objectives, like linking the hard moves or getting through a route in sections.
It’s important to note that the grading scale is not universal. Just like creating contrast with light and shadow, weather, mood, and gear all influence how we experience the jump. Ultimately, the surest route involves listening to your own rhythm and being receptive to what makes each ascent unique.
Brief History of Grading Systems
Climbing grade systems have changed a lot over the years, with roots in local practices and a need for clear standards as the sport grew. At first, the grading system was informal and based on vague descriptions, with climbers grading a climb simply based on how hard it seemed.
The first bouldering grades were French, starting in the 1960s at Fontainebleau. Michel Libert’s L’Abbatoir is an early example of what would develop into the Font-grade system. This system is unique not only for its diversity of weapons, but because it focuses on fast, explosive motions.
It commonly has an “F” prefix, setting it apart from French sport climbing grades which use a lowercase “f.
The Yosemite Decimal System (YDS), developed in the United States, served primarily as a hiking and scrambling grading system. It soon developed to address the most difficult free climbs. The most difficult YDS ascent to date is Silence, completed at a grade of 5.15d in 2017.
In the 1970s, the four-state New England region created its own rating system for icy roads. It started with NEI levels 1-5, then eventually grew to incorporate level 5+. That was a little behind WI grades, which have settled into the standard for ice climbing around WI.
The Welzenbach scale subsequently evolved into the UIAA scale in 1967, which became Europe’s free climbing grading system. For aid climbing, the UIAA’s A0-A5 grades measured the reliability of placements.
During the 1990s Yosemite climbers extended this scale to A6 and began adding pluses to denote in-between steps. Guidebooks were perhaps the defining factor by codifying grades and disseminating them outside local communities.
Better gear and more repetitions have historically increased the threshold for what is considered difficult. This change is proof of how dynamic and changeable these grading systems really are.
Tips for Tackling Harder Climbs
Transitioning from an 8a to V scale introduces a whole new gambit of skills to the climber. It demands intelligent planning and measured expansion. Here are key tips for those looking to move up in grades:
- Train grip strength with fingerboarding, campus boards, and hangboards.
- Build endurance with regular cardio and long, easy routes.
- Focus on footwork and body placement to save strength.
- Break big climbs into short, clear moves or sections.
- Get in the habit of visualizing the route—identifying holds, rests, cruxes—before the climb.
- Learn and switch grips: open-hand, crimp, and pocket grips all come up.
- Visualization, positive self-talk, and breathing are three great techniques you can use to get your mind right.
- Climb with more experienced climbers, seek constructive feedback, and join an area climbing club.
Consistent strength and endurance training prepares the body to endure long days and complicated moves. Combine gym training with real-life climbing—focusing on easier climbs to dial in your movement and all-important climbing pace. Fingerboarding will develop the strength of your fingers, and campus board drills will increase your explosive power for short distances.
Climbers in the U.S. Are commonly familiar with these tools from their use in indoor gyms, which provide a safe and encouraging environment for drill-focused training. Technique is just as important. Proper footwork and body position are key to conserving energy and allowing climbers to make efficient, fluid, fast movements.
Even the most advanced climbers and boulderers put their time in on the easier climbs, building up the technical balance and mental confidence to try the harder problems. Route reading is a skill that gets better with time. This empowers all climbers to know tough stretches in advance, so they can plan when and where to rest.
Mentors, partners, and local climbing organizations can provide insight, advice, encouragement, and camaraderie. This kind of support can allow more climbers to go beyond fear to manage risk. Choosing the appropriate gear and climbing with partners fosters trust and safety, helping to take the edge off intimidating hard climbs.
Beyond 8a: Other Grade Comparisons
As climbers get into the international scene, they frequently encounter new grading systems, each developed and influenced by the local climbing culture and history. So knowing how the 8a (French sport) and V (bouldering) scales compare to others is key.
For climbers looking to push the adventure across borders—or expand their repertoire to new styles—this knowledge becomes even more critical.
French Numerical System
The French numerical system employs a combination of numbers and letters—“7a+,” for instance—to denote minor changes in grade. The Roman numeral UIAA scale is similar, but uses “+” and “−” to denote finer distinctions beyond Grade III.
Here’s a quick look at how these systems line up:
| System | Example Grade | Common Use | Notable Features |
|---|---|---|---|
| French | 8a | Sport, Europe | Arabic numbers, “a/b/c”, “+” |
| V Scale | V8 | Bouldering, USA | Simple numbers, focus on boulders |
| YDS | 5.13b | Sport, USA | Decimal grades, aligns with French |
| UIAA | IX | Trad, Central EU | Roman numerals, “+”/“−” after Grade III |
| Scottish Winter | VIII,8 | Scotland | Dual grades for tech and seriousness |
| M-Grade | M8 | Mixed, Global | Free rock, no set comparison to French |
Understanding these systems helps climbers gauge routes in new places. For example, the YDS and French systems dominate globally, and beyond the beginner level, their grades align closely.
Mixed climbing and aid climbing have their own scales like the M-grade and the “new wave” A-grade system—each with unique ways to rate steepness or required effort.
Grades like M8 might mean 5.10 or 5.12, depending who you ask, since there’s no set standard. Each system shows what local climbers value: some focus on technical moves, others on risk or physical demand.
Comparing grades helps climbers read routes better and pick challenges that fit their skills.
Final Thoughts: Use Grades as Guides
Climbing grades, from 8a to V-scale, serve as a loose guideline and filter for climbing consumers. These figures are meant to provide a general sense of the level of skill expected for a route. It’s pretty standard practice for most climbers to look at grades to gauge a climb, plan for crux sections, and steer clear of climbs that exceed their ability.
An experienced climber who has completed a V5 will know that a V7 boulder problem may be beyond their skill level. They know that it will test their boundaries. Grades help climbers understand their development and choose appropriate challenges. They’re useful for trip planning, goal setting, or simply understanding the progress you’ve made.
Grades are not the end all be all. They don’t always tell the whole story. A V4 in Joshua Tree may feel much harder to some climbers than a V6 in the gym. That’s because not just the style and exposure, but the texture of the rock plays a role.
Grades provide a general prediction of the moves to be made technically, while missing the fear level, the changes in weather, and the sketchy holds. What is difficult for one person might be simple for someone else, whether in terms of reach, form or simply a change in spirit. This is why it’s smart to see grades as one of many tools in a climber’s kit, not the only one.
Personalize the routes to fit your own style and needs. If you’re more comfortable with dynamic moves, you may fly through a steep V5, but have a hard time on an easy slab V3. Climbers should use grades to plan and set real, reachable goals, but not let them rule the fun or growth in the sport.
Climbing Grade Conversions
Frequently Asked Questions
What is Font 8a in bouldering grades?
Font 8a is a European bouldering grade from the Fontainebleau system. It’s about the same difficulty as a V11 on the American V Scale.
How do you convert 8a to V scale?
8a font is approximately equivalent to V11. The conversion isn’t perfect, but almost all climbers and climbing gyms in the U.S. Accept this equivalency.
Why isn’t there a perfect match between the two grading scales?
Grading systems are inherently subjective, depending on the local climbing culture. Other factors such as rock type and style can render any sort of direct conversion difficult.
Which scale should I use when climbing in the U.S.?
Which scale should I use when climbing in the U.S. Most gyms and guidebooks out here describe boulder problems with V grades.
Does climbing 8a mean I can climb V11 everywhere?
Grades can become easier or harder based on the region of the country, type of rock, and personal strengths. Consider putting grades in context.
What’s harder: Font 8a or V11?
So in terms of difficulty, they are on the same level. Both are an example of elite bouldering, which demands exceptional technique and explosive power.
Are there other popular bouldering grade conversions to know?
Yes. For reference, Font 7a is roughly V6, and Font 8b is approximately V13. First, understanding them is crucial if you travel and climb internationally.